Aquino admits seeing 2 Napoles lists

By: TJ Burgonio - 11 years ago

President Benigno Aquino III. MALACANANG PHOTO BUREAU

NAYPYITAW, Burma — President Benigno Aquino III has let the cat out of the bag: He has seen two lists of alleged pork barrel scam players from Janet Lim Napoles.

The President, however, admitted being “taken aback’’ by the fact that the two lists differ on the number of players involved. The second list itself is unsigned.

“I have seen two, and they don’t agree with each other exactly, and they are supposed to have come from Mrs. Napoles,’’ he told reporters at a hotel here Sunday night before flying back to Manila.

The “fluctuations’’ in the number of players involved were so glaring that he had wondered aloud: “Ano ba talaga, Ate? (Which one is the real thing, Sis?)’’

“Will I ask her why she changed? And I don’t want to talk to her. She can talk to the people who will be in a position to evaluate evidence and that means primarily lawyers,’’ he said.

Mr. Aquino said the list handed by Napoles’ family to rehabilitation czar Secretary Panfilo Lacson was another list, and that even this has a “substantial detail’’ that differs from the two.

Mr. Aquino indicated that Napoles or her camp transmitted the first list to him at a time when she “didn’t want to talk’’ to Justice Secretary Leila de Lima. He gave this list to De Lima.

The second list was personally handed by Napoles to De Lima after a five-hour-long talk in April where the alleged scam mastermind vowed to tell all and offered to turn state witness.

And contrary to the perception of many, Mr. Aquino said this second list was unsigned.

“Are you saying supposedly signed? My understanding is that it is still a work in progress. The way she was narrating certain things, she will show some alleged evidence to it, then she’d go off on tangents,’’ he said.

And given the discrepancies, disclosing it in public becomes problematic, he said.

“Is it safe to reveal? Even that by itself you have to resolve first. Why are there differences from the information you are getting from one witness who is supposed to be narrating facts?’’ he said.

“So one cannot escape the suspicion that instead of trying to clarify matters, [they] are trying to cloud the whole issue. That makes the process much more difficult at arriving at the truth,’’ he added.

Mr. Aquino did not discount the possibility that there was a plan to deluge the government with so many details requiring thorough verification that could last until 2016, when he steps down from office.

“By the time you’re ready, our time is up. We’re conscious that this could be also the objective,’’ he said.

It has now become clear why De Lima has so far rejected public clamor for her to make the second Napoles list public: it’s unsigned and conflicts with other such lists.

Lacson has fanned calls for its disclosure after he bared there were 12 senators, which he later changed to 16, in the list given him by Napoles’ family in March.

Senators Jinggoy Estrada and Ramon Revilla Jr., decrying that they, along with Sen. Juan Ponce Enrile, were being singled out for prosecution over the scam, have also called for the disclosure of the list.

Accused of receiving kickbacks from the pork barrel racket, the three senators are fighting indictment for plunder with the anti-graft court Sandiganbayan.

As to whether Napoles could qualify as a state witness is a matter that the Executive Department would leave to Ombudsman’s decision, the President said.

He explained that the government’s position was that she prepare an affidavit with the aid of her counsel, and consistent with the Bill of Rights.

“Now, after she’s done with that, personally I’d rather give it to the Ombudsman right away because that will be the end point. That will be where you will determine value of the testimony and be able to evaluate; and that is the only arm that can file a case before the Sandiganbayan,’’ he said.

Mr. Aquino indicated that it was clear between him and De Lima what Napoles ought to do next: “Finish what you want to say, you can submit it to us or we can also submit it to the Ombudsman for the proper evaluation.’’

“So, in effect, the submission will be the start of evaluating what she’s saying and seeing if there is proof to back up what she is saying,’’ he added.

The President, however, said that Napoles’ affidavit would be thoroughly analyzed for its value.

“The value for us, is that if she says the truth, thank you. If she says some of the truth and some of it lies, even the truth that will support the lies or will try to make the lies seemingly true, will help us in ferreting out the truth,’’ he said.

When he received the first Napoles list, Mr. Aquino said he merely glanced at it and then turned it over to his legal advisers, including De Lima, because being a non-lawyer, he could not say whether this constituted evidence.

“There are some alleged [allies], and there are many who are not,’’ he said when asked if political allies were in the list. “You know, when I say there’s discrepancy, I’m saying that the numbers fluctuate.’’